Your opinion on the legality of shells and mortars

jps24

Noble the 1st
#1
In the states, you can buy shells and mortar racks off the shelf without a license, yet in the UK you need a license to buy them and there is a limited range. What are your views on this? Do you think they should be legalised or stay as they are?
 

berry1

Wizard the 2nd
#2
You can buy Shells but you cant buy Rockets or cakes to the size that we can over here. You don't need a license to possess Shells or pro material you simply have to be a professional company. I do feel this has good and bad points, i think they should create a license so experienced enthusiasts can have access to Shells and other cat-4 gear but not be posses-sable by the general public like for example rockets are.
 
#3
I mentioned this to a retailer other day. he pointed to a large cake and said in effect they are the same. i suppose over here we have larger cakes compared to the us and we dont really need mortars.
 

jps24

Noble the 1st
#4
berry1 said:
You can buy Shells but you cant buy Rockets or cakes to the size that we can over here. You don't need a license to possess Shells or pro material you simply have to be a professional company. I do feel this has good and bad points, i think they should create a license so experienced enthusiasts can have access to Shells and other cat-4 gear but not be posses-sable by the general public like for example rockets are.
Im actually based in the UK!!! Also, im under the impression that you can only use cat 4 stuff for proffessional use, so that is effectively a licsense
[hr]
doctor frankenstein said:
I mentioned this to a retailer other day. he pointed to a large cake and said in effect they are the same. i suppose over here we have larger cakes compared to the us and we dont really need mortars.
The good part of shells though is that you can customize your show to a higher level
 

berry1

Wizard the 2nd
#5
That is correct you have to be a professional displaying company to have cat-4 gear. But there is no license that gives the right to buy/own/fire cat-4 material. Pro crew members working for Displaying companies can fire cat-4 through company displays but they don't have a license to buy or possess them for personal use.

Im actually based in the UK!!! Also, im under the impression that you can only use cat 4 stuff for proffessional use, so that is effectively a licsense
 

jps24

Noble the 1st
#6
berry1 said:
That is correct you have to be a professional displaying company to have cat-4 gear. But there is no license that gives the right to buy/own/fire cat-4 material. Pro crew members working for Displaying companies can fire cat-4 through company displays but they don't have a license to buy or possess them for personal use.

Im actually based in the UK!!! Also, im under the impression that you can only use cat 4 stuff for proffessional use, so that is effectively a licsense
Thats a fair point :rolleyes:
 

Maddog

Esquire the 5th
#7
it's all cat 4 stuff no license is needed but only display companies can buy own store and fire these types of fireworks for ovbious reasons i remember reading years ago a container containg cat 3 and 4 fireworks was broke into and shells were stolen improperly fired and caused around £70000 in damage

theres a reason joe bloggs can't get a hold of them
 

jps24

Noble the 1st
#8
Wee Jock the holy pyro nutter! said:
it's all cat 4 stuff no license is needed but only display companies can buy own store and fire these types of fireworks for ovbious reasons i remember reading years ago a container containg cat 3 and 4 fireworks was broke into and shells were stolen improperly fired and caused around £70000 in damage

theres a reason joe bloggs can't get a hold of them
But if people were aware of how to fire them safely and mortar tubes were provided these sorts of things would be unlikely. You will always have people not firing correctly and causing damage but thats just a fact of life
 

berry1

Wizard the 2nd
#9
Thats why i said i thought a Firework Course specially for shells that gives enthusiasts a special license to purchase them would be a good idea. Would be much safer and section off the general public.

But if people were aware of how to fire them safely and mortar tubes were provided these sorts of things would be unlikely. You will always have people not firing correctly and causing damage but thats just a fact of life
 

Maddog

Esquire the 5th
#10
berry1 said:
Thats why i said i thought a Firework Course specially for shells that gives enthusiasts a special license to purchase them would be a good idea. Would be much safer and section off the general public.

But if people were aware of how to fire them safely and mortar tubes were provided these sorts of things would be unlikely. You will always have people not firing correctly and causing damage but thats just a fact of life
I would love something like this but theres a reason these types of fireworks are classed and 1.2G and 1.1G it's something in my view thats too powerfull for a back yard display

i mean it's ok saying we have been in a course or such experience but if you have an 8 inch shell and it breaks in the mortar tube or has a low break in the air

just imagine us enthusiasts having something like this and it going horribly wrong with a mortar break or low fire break (it doesn't bear thinking about the consequences)

at least if the cat 3 stuff we have goes wrong it's not as devestating as what a shell could be just looking at the power of an 8 inch shell below

 
#11
It was only after the new British Standard rules for fireworks came in that shells were made illegal to buy to the general public,before that you could buy then legally in the shops,i fired a 3 inch from the back garden once and you used to be able to get smaller ones too in packs of three,the stupid thing is you can't buy a mortar-fired shell but you can buy a 3 or 4 inch ball-headed rocket which is the same thing but on a stick!
 

berry1

Wizard the 2nd
#12
Having shells legal doesn't mean they have to be immense like 8 inch ones thats huge lol. Lets say a 4-5 inch shell fired correctly but malfunctions chances are that wont cause much more damage than the Total Wipeout that got stuck in the tube.


I would love something like this but theres a reason these types of fireworks are classed and 1.2G and 1.1G it's something in my view thats too powerfull for a back yard display
i mean it's ok saying we have been in a course or such experience but if you have an 8 inch shell and it breaks in the mortar tube or has a low break in the air
just imagine us enthusiasts having something like this and it going horribly wrong with a mortar break or low fire break (it doesn't bear thinking about the consequences)
at least if the cat 3 stuff we have goes wrong it's not as devestating as what a shell could be just looking at the power of an 8 inch shell below
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RCmvSjhsEzA
 

jps24

Noble the 1st
#13
Im not talking about 8 inch shells!! Im talking like 3 inch max! I think it would be ok to have CONSUMER shells but i agree with you not just for a back garden

Wee Jock the holy pyro nutter! said:
berry1 said:
Thats why i said i thought a Firework Course specially for shells that gives enthusiasts a special license to purchase them would be a good idea. Would be much safer and section off the general public.

But if people were aware of how to fire them safely and mortar tubes were provided these sorts of things would be unlikely. You will always have people not firing correctly and causing damage but thats just a fact of life
I would love something like this but theres a reason these types of fireworks are classed and 1.2G and 1.1G it's something in my view thats too powerfull for a back yard display

i mean it's ok saying we have been in a course or such experience but if you have an 8 inch shell and it breaks in the mortar tube or has a low break in the air

just imagine us enthusiasts having something like this and it going horribly wrong with a mortar break or low fire break (it doesn't bear thinking about the consequences)

at least if the cat 3 stuff we have goes wrong it's not as devestating as what a shell could be just looking at the power of an 8 inch shell below

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RCmvSjhsEzA
 
#14
One of the main reasons they we're banned for sale to the public was when a School teacher was firing shells from a mortar tube and although he had apparently do this before. He positioned himself wrongly and was subsequently hit by the shell leaving the tube, I belive it hit his head, he died of his injuries.
Many professional companies will take on people to train where you can get experience of professional firing why not check a few out. Although even in professional companies I believe that the general progression towards electrical firing of shells is not a bad thing for everyone's safety.
 

AnthonyUKpyro

Royal Knight the 1st
#15
Shells before 1997 have always been sold to the public whether that be in display packs via mail-order and occasionally in retailers with three or more in a pack with a matching mortar tube, but in 1997 they were banned totally from Cat3 display firework retail sale and pushed to Cat4 professional status only due to a spate of accidents, in some cases this down to being user error by users going back to a mortar tube where a shell hasn't fired and the result of sudden detonation and explosion causing injury and immediate death to the users, there has also been sudden detonation of the shell from ignition and the users being injured leaning near or over the top of the mortar.

However I DO agree 1.5", 2" and 3" shells SHOULD be allowed to be sold to, and used by, those enthusiasts who have taken a professional style training course and have obtained relative certification and qualifications and a valid permit or licence issued to allow those users to purchase fire and use them legitimately. ;) The shells should also have a long piece of visco to enable the users to get back safely before detonation blind rise and explosion of aural and/or visual effects.
 
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